Global Mapper v25.0

outputing to Garmin .mp file

wmiswm
wmiswm Global Mapper UserTrusted User
edited October 2012 in Technical Support
When outputing to Garmin .mp file, GM will try to assign a "gm_type" according to the "typ" attribute. Is it possible to "teach" GM to assign the "gm_type" according to the value of a specific attribute, say "GRMN_TYPE", and yet keeping the "gm_type" value compatible with the .mp specification?

Comments

  • global_mapper
    global_mapper Administrator
    edited October 2012
    Global Mapper will already map both ways based on a MP_TYPE attribute and the MP_TYPE is the Garmin type code. These codes work assigned specifically to a feature or also in the default attribute list for a feature type.

    Thanks,

    Mike
    Global Mapper Guru
    gmsupport@bluemarblegeo.com
    http://www.globalmapper.com
  • wmiswm
    wmiswm Global Mapper User Trusted User
    edited October 2012
    Thank you very much. I realize that I can solve the problem of custom type by generating a csv table, with attribute value of the say "GRMN_TYPE" matching to a custom "MP_TYPE", then join the table and add the custom MP_TYPE attribute to the object.

    There is however another issue with GM when outputing to the polish mp format. mp format actually support individual layer specification through the attributes of DATA1, DATA2..............DATA7 etc (DATA1 corresponds to layer 1, DATA2 corresponds to layer 2, and so on). Individual layers can be specified for each object. However, GM support only the ENDLEVEL attribute. When outputing to mp file type by GM, all the layer specification will be converted to the ENDLEVEL specification. The implication is that, GM will not be able to prepare a map with layers appearing only at high zoom level; all objects will appear at low zoom levels.

    Is there any way to solve this issue inside of GM?
  • wmiswm
    wmiswm Global Mapper User Trusted User
    edited October 2012
    After further testing, I realize that I can retain the DATAn attribute by selecting the "output non mp attributes" option. There is however still another issue. The ENDLEVEL attribute will still be added to the object. Is there any way to disable adding this ENDLEVEL attribute to mp files so that I can use the DATAn specification?

    If nothing can be done, I suppose I then can only use a text editor to delete the ENDLEVEL attribute outside of GM.
  • global_mapper
    global_mapper Administrator
    edited October 2012
    The ENDLEVEL is usually what you would use to specify at which levels a particular feature will be present. The DATAn members are for manually specifying a different vertex list to use for a feature at zoomed out levels, but in most cases it seems it would be better to just let the map compiler automatically handle simplifying the feature vertices for display at lower zoom levels rather than trying to manually manage this task which ends up being quite error prone. When I worked at Garmin and created these maps all of the time we never separately created geometry for zoomed out layers, we always let the map compiler tools handle that automatically.

    Thanks,

    Mike
    Global Mapper Guru
    gmsupport@bluemarblegeo.com
    http://www.globalmapper.com
  • wmiswm
    wmiswm Global Mapper User Trusted User
    edited October 2012
    Thank you very much for your feedback. The reason for manually specifying the layer is for the purpose of adding in features that will only appear at high zoom out levels but not low zoom in levels. I plan to use the ENDLEVEL specification for most features, with a only few using the DATAn specification. It will not be too troublesome for me to handle this separately outside of GM, only wish to understand whether there is any way to do this inside of GM to simplify the workflow.

    By the way, proper mp files should have a header section. Is there a way to specify the header section inside of GM?
  • global_mapper
    global_mapper Administrator
    edited October 2012
    So features that only appear when zoomed out but then disappear when you are zoomed in? At Garmin we usually had different kinds of maps, like basemaps and then detailed maps, so there wasn't ever a case where you would have a feature in the same map that you wanted to see when zoomed out but then have it go away when you zoomed in. I can imagine it though.

    The header section is controlled by based on your export settings, but if you have some particular settings you can use the template options for MP export to based the header on your own template MP file.

    Thanks,

    Mike
    Global Mapper Guru
    gmsupport@bluemarblegeo.com
    http://www.globalmapper.com
  • wmiswm
    wmiswm Global Mapper User Trusted User
    edited October 2012
    I totally agree with you. In most cases, features appearing in high zoom out levels should also appear in low zoom in levels. I need this option because I wish to use one style for high zoom out levels, but with increasing zoom in, I wish to use another style to represent the feature. Take road as an example. At high zoom out level, roads should be polylines. However, with increasing zoom in, up to about 1:5000 level, a road should not be a polyline. Instead, detail features of the road should then appear on the map, such as road width, pedastrian walk width, delta, road bank, on street parking area, zebra cross etc. If a road polyline extends all the way down to the lowest zoom in level, it will very much confuse the map. In such case, at lower zoom in levels, the road polyline is best converted from visible lines to transparent invisible lines to allow for the detail road features to appear properly. This is just one example of why hidding or removing features at low zoom in levels is put into practical use. Much more examples will be encountered when working with 1:5000 or 1:1000 detail maps.
  • global_mapper
    global_mapper Administrator
    edited October 2012
    I use I can see what you are describing. Is there an attribute value similar to ENDLEVEL in MP files that specifies perhaps that features should be only at some levels at the top? It seems like that would be a better option than separately providing the coordinate lists.

    Or another option would be to create multiple maps, one for the higher zoom levels where you have the roads as lines but that doesn't go down as far, then another for the full detail where you have the roads as areas.

    Thanks,

    Mike
    Global Mapper Guru
    gmsupport@bluemarblegeo.com
    http://www.globalmapper.com
  • wmiswm
    wmiswm Global Mapper User Trusted User
    edited October 2012
    In cgpsmapper, EndLevel works together with DataLevel as a pair; while EndLevel specifies the highest zoom out layer, DataLevel specifies the starting layer. If DataLevel is not specified, then cgpsmapper assumes that the starting layer is layer 0; if EndLevel is not specified, then the compiler assumes that the top layer is the same as the starting layer. DATAn is another type of control in cgpsmapper, it specifies the layers one by one manually. GM has native support to work with the DataLevel and EndLevel commands, but not the DATAn. The same effect of DATAn can be achieved in GM by using the DataLevel command without EndLevel, but then will require multiple data entry in GM (say the same layer of data copied into multiple overlays for entry into multiple DATAn).

    Anyway, cgpsmapper has stopped development, and is expected to fade out in a few years. The control of level by the Garmin MPC is very rudimentary and buggy. I regret that the developer of cgpsmapper has given up cgpsmapper. I really wonder what compiler Garmin actually uses in house; I am sure that they are not using MPC as their in house compiler, at least not the released versions.
  • global_mapper
    global_mapper Administrator
    edited October 2012
    Garmin does have their own in-house compiler that is not used in MPC (at least it wasn't originally). I actually developed MPC while I was at Garmin, but left to concentrate on Global Mapper full time there before it was complete, so I'm not sure what type of support it has received since then as that was about 2005.

    Thanks,

    Mike
    Global Mapper Guru
    gmsupport@bluemarblegeo.com
    http://www.globalmapper.com
  • wmiswm
    wmiswm Global Mapper User Trusted User
    edited October 2012
    Things have changed a lot in the computer world since 2005, but not much in Garmin. You made a good decision of leaving Garmin for GM. The Garmin map system in terms of flexibility in custom style design is very appealing, but at the same time, most users cannot benefit from making their own custom maps for their own purpose. All Garmin map compilers on the market today are just too complicated for layman users. Will you consider to bridge GM directly with cgpsmapper without going through the mp file intermediate? There will not be anything difficult to hand over the data directly to an external compiler.

    Alternatively, as I suggested before, improving the custom style function and creating mobile solutions of GM will simply blow the Garmin map system away.
  • global_mapper
    global_mapper Administrator
    edited October 2012
    I suspect the slowdown in advancement from Garmin after 2005 may be related to my departure to concentrate on GM full time :)

    We could potentially consider making a more complete package for the creation of custom Garmin vector maps directly from Global Mapper, but it would be a pretty big effort and it seems most people are more interested in the raster KMZ/JNX export which is much more straightforward. The creation of custom Garmin vector maps is a very complex process with a lot of things to consider, especially when making route-able maps and address lookup. Typically rather than individual users making their own custom vector maps instead a company will make an entire map product for Garmin devices and then sell that (or give it away in some cases) to customers. That way the maps are still made by those who have the knowledge necessary to create a fully functional vector map.

    The custom raster maps, which I suspect will eventually be available on all Garmin devices, is much more straightforward and serves the purposes of most users so long as they already have a good route-able roadway network and POIs to search on. And with the custom raster maps all styles come across with no special setup by the user. It is what-you-see-is-what-you-get!

    Thanks,

    Mike
    Global Mapper Guru
    gmsupport@bluemarblegeo.com
    http://www.globalmapper.com
  • wmiswm
    wmiswm Global Mapper User Trusted User
    edited October 2012
    Garmin is unfortunately going in that direction, but I would criticize it as unrealistic. By going raster, what competitors are on the market? I would prefer a smartphone/mini-tab to display the raster map rather than using a Garmin device. Garmin device should be dedicated to vector format.

    By the way, linking GM directly with cgpsmapper is nothing complicated. GM can consider it as a short term workaround for layman users. In the long run, GM can consider selling a Garmin compiler as add on.

    Anyway, my wish is that GM can adopt the sophisticated graphic design interface of MPC, and introducing mobile solutions of GM so that I can use GM output directly on my mobile devices.
  • global_mapper
    global_mapper Administrator
    edited October 2012
    I don't think Garmin is abandoning vector maps by any stretch, they are just also offering raster to go along with it. I find it very useful as background maps when hiking in remote locations with no cell coverage. For vector maps I'm sure they would much prefer to sell you there own maps or a licensed map product than have users make their own maps. As a user I would much prefer to just buy some professional maps rather than spend a bunch of time making my own. My time is way too valuable to spend making custom maps whenever there is one for that region that I can just purchase.

    If we find a big demand for the custom Garmin integration we might add it, but it seems most of those interested in custom vector map creation got what they need out of the bulk of Polish MP work done several years ago and there hasn't been many feature requests since. I've also found that the amount of support required for full custom map creation like for Lowrance is so huge it's almost better to not even have the feature as it's hard to educate users about the limitations of devices themselves and how to get the results they want. It's a lot of support for just a few licenses.

    Thanks,

    Mike
    Global Mapper Guru
    gmsupport@bluemarblegeo.com
    http://www.globalmapper.com
  • wmiswm
    wmiswm Global Mapper User Trusted User
    edited October 2012
    Unfortunately in my place, the official Garmin map is just not applicable for hiking. I am not particularly an enthuasist of Garmin either. The Garmin device hardware technology is too outdated. What I really have high hope on is the GM system with mobile support and sophisticate style design function.